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Post by onepenguin0 on Aug 1, 2016 2:17:13 GMT
Keep in mind that while the historical fight of Rikidouzan versus Kimura happened in '54, the equivalent didn't necessarily happen then in the Baki world. Doppo is 55 in 1992; Baki is 17 at the same time. Yuujiro is 36 at the beginning of the story (1992). Somehow Emi got pregnant with Baki in 1977. I chalk that one up to Itagaki not being able to count. Because of the sliding timescale (google it if unfamiliar), they haven't aged more than the narrative says they've aged (despite technology changes and whatever else) - one year passed in the span from the beginning of Grappler to the end of Son of Ogre, then two more years passed leading into Dou, iirc. So Doppo is 58 now, Yuujiro is 39, and Baki is 19, 20 or 21 (I don't know when he turned 18, and that 1977 thing may allow him to be 19). Yuujiro raped Jane in 1973, so that makes Jack 19 or 20 in '92, and 22-24 in "present" Baki. Tokugawa's actual age has never been mentioned, as far as I know. Now, I remember reading that Doppo is ~35 in Kenjin, but I have absolutely no source on that information. I know that where I got that info was decently reliable, I just have no clue where I got it. Regardless, he is at least younger than 45 - the Shinshinkai school was established when he was 45, which was after he left Kourakuen and stopped hanging out with Tokugawa. If my recollection of Doppo being 35 in Kenjin is correct, that means it's only been 23 years. If Tokugawa was 70 then, he could be 93 now; there's not necessarily that much visible difference between those ages. Hell, Kaku looks exactly the same as he did when he was 90, which was over 50 years ago. Tangentially related: Yuujiro's mother is ancient as all-hell.  @shen - Doppo didn't have his son naturally, remember? He adopted him from the circus. |
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Post by onepenguin0 on Aug 1, 2016 6:29:59 GMT
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Post by shenlong on Aug 1, 2016 10:19:54 GMT
Actually, I don't remember that, because I didn't read the part about Katsumi being adopted. Keep in mind that while the historical fight of Rikidouzan versus Kimura happened in '54, the equivalent didn't necessarily happen then in the Baki world. Doppo is 55 in 1992; Baki is 17 at the same time. Yuujiro is 36 at the beginning of the story (1992). Somehow Emi got pregnant with Baki in 1977. I chalk that one up to Itagaki not being able to count. Because of the sliding timescale (google it if unfamiliar), they haven't aged more than the narrative says they've aged (despite technology changes and whatever else) - one year passed in the span from the beginning of Grappler to the end of Son of Ogre, then two more years passed leading into Dou, iirc. So Doppo is 58 now, Yuujiro is 39, and Baki is 19, 20 or 21 (I don't know when he turned 18, and that 1977 thing may allow him to be 19). Yuujiro raped Jane in 1973, so that makes Jack 19 or 20 in '92, and 22-24 in "present" Baki. Tokugawa's actual age has never been mentioned, as far as I know. Ok, see, that's where I just have to call a stop to this. Sliding timescale is useable in big franchises because it's really the only way it can work. Baki is a single work and it shouldn't be that complex to estimate the year things are happening. There's no reason for there to be a sliding timescale except because Itagaki wanted to draw Bush Jr and Obama. Besides, even if we admit the sliding timescale, Yuichiro wrecking soldiers in 1945 was shown at the end of Son of Ogre, which is happening at the very least in 2008 since Obama is there. At this point, the sliding timescale is just a fancy way of saying the timeline is fucked without actually saying it. I repeat, Joe Frazier was in his prime just at the same time as Usain Bolt. It's just as likely to assume that the Bush we see in Baki is Bush's father, who also was president. In 1993, Obama was 32 years old. It's insanely young to be the president (Theodore Roosevelt was 42 and he's the youngest ever), but it's not IMPOSSIBLE. Or maybe the Bakiverse is subject to time disturbance by someone who has mastered an extremely advanced technology and who will end up being the ultimate villain to the manga once people realize how nonsensical their timeline is. Or maybe it's even a Hanma from the past future. Let's call them superboy prime LordofTime Hanma. LordofTime Hanma is so physically strong and good at kung fu that they punched the space time continuum and created a rift in his family's history allowing Baki, Yujiro and their close ones to age only three years in more than 15. Ok, now about Dou 100, what the fuck is wrong with Tokyo ? There's a tropical atmosphere in the sewers ? Lizards and reptiles of all kind thrive there ? Like, in the diarreah whater full of various chemicals ? Yeah, sure, I can't think why that wouldn't work. But, like what do they eat ? There have to be herbivores for predatory reptiles like that humongous crocodile to survive. How did that crocodile survive for so long unnoticed when it obviously can only take a few passages big enough for him ? What would the herbivores eat for that matter ? Unless there are also plants growing there, I can't see what, and if there are plants, they need sunlight. In the sewers. Yeah. Or maybe the people of Tokyo are incredibly wasteful and somehow chug vegetables and plants in the sewers instead of trashbins. Don't sewer workers ever notice these reptiles crawling around the apparently huge tunnels ? I thing we've found a new way to protect threatened reptile species. Throw them in the sewers. I'm starting to seriously doubt Dr. Payne's credentials as a scientist. Seriously, I want Itagaki to stop drawing fights and start developping this amazing world he's been building where there's a tropical ecosystem under Tokyo and human cloning is really easy and ghosts can be brought back into our time. |
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Post by dannythm on Aug 1, 2016 13:39:31 GMT
Anyway, that stuff happened in 1954, but I guess the Baki version (with Yuichiro as Kimura) could have taken place later. Yuichiro was judo throwing US soldiers into the ground in 1945 just after the end of the war, though. So him fighting Rikigouzan could very well have happened in 54. Let's be kind to Tokugawa and admit he's 50 at the time. That means he's over 100 years old by the end of Son of Ogre because Obama was the US president at the time and he got elected in 2008. That also means that if Doppo was 20 in 1954, he must be over 70 in SoO. Anyway, that leaves Yuichiro and Yujiro more time to have kids. If Yuichiro was like 18 in 1945 (he looks older but whatever), he's 27 in 1954. I believe Yujiro went around kicking US soldiers in the Vietnam war. That's a long war, but US troops were mostly involved starting 1965 and left in 1973, so let's assume Yujiro was there for a few years during that timespan. Let's assume he was like 16 (I remember faintly that he looked pretty young in some of those pages) at some point when he was in Vietnam. We can reasonnably theorize he was born between 1949 and 1957, which means that, at the youngest, he'd be around 51 years old in 2008 around the time Obama is elected. That actually seems retty reasonnable to me. Yujiro's basically superhuman and I wouldn't be surprised if he was between 50 and 60 by the end of Son of Ogre, but barely looked 40. It also means neither Yuichiro nor Yujiro had kids very young. Doppo, on the other hand, is ancient as fuck. He also had his son really, really old. And fucking tokugawa aged by more than 50 years and barely looks older, what the fuck. You are getting something wrong, in the bakiverse only about 2 years have passed since the start of the series and Dou, so if you assume that it is 1993 and disregard the dates about Bush, Obama or the Skytree the ages of the characters fit way way better (Doppo was 51 in the tournament and baki 17 which would make Yujiro be 36), but Itakagi doesn't give a fuck and he keeps adding elements of the real present in Baki even if the time frame does not fit, so Tokugawa is comfortably sitting at age 70-80. |
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Post by shenlong on Aug 1, 2016 15:06:32 GMT
You are getting something wrong, in the bakiverse only about 2 years have passed since the start of the series and Dou onepenguin0 just said that and I added that data into my attempt at analyzing the timeline, how am I getting it wrong now ? |
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Post by dannythm on Aug 1, 2016 19:22:36 GMT
You are getting something wrong, in the bakiverse only about 2 years have passed since the start of the series and Dou onepenguin0 just said that and I added that data into my attempt at analyzing the timeline, how am I getting it wrong now ? When I wrote that I hadn't seen the exange you guys had, so I was answering to your previous post. |
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Post by onepenguin0 on Aug 3, 2016 9:24:24 GMT
Two things: Thing 1: Baki Dou 120 is out in Korean. zangsisi.net/?p=107617 Hyped for next chapter. Musashi's actually been seriously injured for the first time in this series. Can Pickle actually pull this off? Even if he can't, will Musashi really be in any shape to fight any of the other characters like Baki or Motobe afterwards? He's missing a goddamn shoulder. Thing 2: We put out Kenjin chapter 2, the first "new" translated Kenjin chapter in years. This chapter is actually decently important to Baki Dou: without it, you can't really know who Sabu Kyouichirou is, nor why he's significant enough to be consistently featured in these new Dou chapters. spinybackmanga.com/?manga=Kenjin&chapter=Baki+Gaiden+Kenjin+Chapter+002Hope you guys enjoy, and don't forget to like comment and subscribe |
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Post by dannythm on Aug 3, 2016 13:55:49 GMT
Kenjin was a good read, I like where the story is going. i guess we'll get to see that first fight where Yujiro gave the scar to Doppo.
Baki 183: "Even guns and arrows wouldn't bring him down" well... but a pickle did I guess =P
Dou:120 musashi seems really happy and excited and Pickle is reviving an old wound, the next chapter will be really interesting.
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Post by shenlong on Aug 3, 2016 14:53:16 GMT
Those are cool chapters. So that Sabu guy, I guess he's the one who met Musashi near the beginning of Dou where Musashi broke his swords ? Pretty awesome fight between him and Doppo.
Pickle is once again defying basic anatomy but not dying with that kind of wound.His clavicle, scapula, at least 3 ribs in their front and back (maybe two more in the back only) have been cleaved and obviously his trapeze and back muscles are dead. Plus Musashi has cut right through his left Lung, subclavian artery and cephalic vein, two huge blood vessels. The blade must have passed a few centimeters from the heart. Pickle should be completely unable to move his entire left side of his torso, he should probably have lost consciousness already and he should be drowning is his own. Whatever happens, he's basically a dead man walking at this point.
I'm also unsure how Musashi is moving his left arm with half his shoulder muscle gone (Pickle could have torn off the same two blood vessels doing that).
So basically, the next chapter should be Pickle trying to breathe in and collapsing in shock before dying seconds later. We'll probably have another charge, though.
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Post by dannythm on Aug 4, 2016 13:33:21 GMT
Those are cool chapters. So that Sabu guy, I guess he's the one who met Musashi near the beginning of Dou where Musashi broke his swords ? Pretty awesome fight between him and Doppo. Pickle is once again defying basic anatomy but not dying with that kind of wound.His clavicle, scapula, at least 3 ribs in their front and back (maybe two more in the back only) have been cleaved and obviously his trapeze and back muscles are dead. Plus Musashi has cut right through his left Lung, subclavian artery and cephalic vein, two huge blood vessels. The blade must have passed a few centimeters from the heart. Pickle should be completely unable to move his entire left side of his torso, he should probably have lost consciousness already and he should be drowning is his own. Whatever happens, he's basically a dead man walking at this point. I'm also unsure how Musashi is moving his left arm with half his shoulder muscle gone (Pickle could have torn off the same two blood vessels doing that). So basically, the next chapter should be Pickle trying to breathe in and collapsing in shock before dying seconds later. We'll probably have another charge, though. They are using imaginary lungs and muscles, so they can move and live no problem. |
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Post by ungora on Aug 6, 2016 10:56:08 GMT
There's how real world biology works, and there's how Itagaki's world biology works and i think it's great like that  I thought when the old wounds appeared on Pickle's back that in fact it was happening because he was unconsciously doing the same as Yujiro or Baki with the muscle demon back thing, potentially hinting at some kind of ancestry/blood lineage link between them and Pickle, explaining somehow why Pickle is that superhuman. But it's probably not it. Still not liking that fight at all, as it's more of an execution than an actual battle considering it's been shown already in previous chapter than Musashi in pure strength is equal to Pickle + he is much superior in technique and he even has a sword . (sure the guy that is barely thinking more than a child only thinks of eating, but still, something rub me very wrong with how this fight is setup) But at least it was a bit of a funny chapter with all the silly biology things, reminding me a bit of thos like those hilarious "scientific" explanation Miyashita regularly did in his Otokojuku series. and thanks for the Kenjn miniserie scanlation, Doppo is one of my favorite character in the Baki universe, nice to see more of his story. |
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Post by onepenguin0 on Aug 6, 2016 12:57:23 GMT
I'm assuming you don't remember Son of Ogre? This form that Pickle's unveiling here is a result of being crushed by a T-Rex's jaws; generally referred to as "Scar Mode". Nothing to do with demon back. It's Pickle's strongest form - the scar doesn't become visible until he forces his muscles to drastically expand. The only other time he's ever used it was in his last fight against Baki. It essentially makes him stronger, faster, etc - perhaps enough to deal truly debilitating damage to Musashi. That being said, I do like Shen's idea that Pickle will collapse before he can do anything. That would be an amazing and dark twist; would break the mold even more.
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Post by ungora on Aug 6, 2016 13:21:52 GMT
The collapse before doing anything has already been done for the Musashi vs Retsu, when Retsu was collecting his memory about "as long as your head is not cut you may still being able to fight" before simply dying instead of doing anything else. I don't think Itagaki will go on the same kind of fight ending for the Pickle case, Pickle is probably going to wildly rush toward Musashi just one more time before dying, maybe dying while running at him. I'll have to re-read the Baki vs Pickle fight it seems, i have completely forgotten this part already happening during the fight. Oh well, getting old do that to you unfortunately, but at least Son of Ogre is always a good read, getting back to it isn't an annoyance  |
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Post by shenlong on Aug 7, 2016 4:33:55 GMT
That fight is a bit unconfortable, but really, every fight with Pickle is unconfortable. I mean, here is an ancien caveman thing miraculously alive after having been preserved for millions of years, and what are people doing with it ? They put him in an arena to see if he's stronger than a dude who does kung fu. That whole arc of Son of Ogre is about people that kept sending martial artists to beat Pickle up for sports. Pretty fucked up if you ask me.
As for this fight, I can't see Pickle surviving at this point. I mean, sure he's going to madly charge as many times as necessary because drama, but once the fight is over, I can't see how Pickle isn't going to die from that wound. Even assuming he wasn't technically dead already, I can't see Pickle lying still on an operation table having his innards get stiched up by surgeons.
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Post by dannythm on Aug 7, 2016 11:31:30 GMT
Musashi was literally resurrected through a clone, and Hanayama was able to leave the hospital walking the same day he received a bullet to the head.
Don't underestimate the medical science of the bakiverse.
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